How do you determine what is a metaphor and what is literal in the Bible?

Naysin27 · 2012-05-23T04:26:54.079596+00:00

But anyone who is searching for what is true should be trying to find out what was the intended meaning, not your selected meaning.

Searching? Yes. Finding a definitive answer? Not likely.

Let scripture prove scripture. The Bible has a harmonious theme;

Christians routinely ignore scripture in order to preserve this illusion of a "harmonious theme".

If you search the Bible trying to find what you want, what doctrine you want, or what negative muck you would like to throw, you can take any phrase or sentence and twist it any which way you want.

That also applies to every Christian who wants to make the Bible conform to his beliefs.

you would try to fully understand what its intended message is,

The Bible has many intended messages.

You establish what is metaphor or what is literal by the context. The context of the passage and the context of the Bible as a whole.

"From the beginning of creation, God made them male and female" (Mark 6)

Literal or figurative?

Naysin27 · 2012-05-23T04:19:50.724869+00:00

Just focus on the small parts of the bible that coincide with contemporary secular humanism,

New Age Christian god is so much nicer than Bible Christian god, isn't he?

hobdobgoblin · 2012-05-23T04:17:14.051542+00:00

My father just throws me in a fire pit where there is much wailing and gnashing of teeth.

hobdobgoblin · 2012-05-23T04:14:15.434470+00:00

Good parents protect their children from making mortal errors until such time as they are capable of making correct decisions. Good parents properly instruct their children about life and all of its dangers - such as people who will lie and mislead them. Parents should be forgiving of their children's mistakes when they are young and don't know any better. And, finally, good parents do not punish the grandchildren for the sins of the children. The Abrahamic God is not a good parent.

If you define a good parent as one who disciplines their children and makes them learn from their mistakes, the Abrahamic God is a good parent.

Matthew 7:13-14 says that the vast majority of all humans who will ever exist are condemned to eternal damnation. The Abrahamic God is a shitty teacher. He does not make his children learn from their mistakes. The Abrahamic God is not a good parent.

hobdobgoblin · 2012-05-23T04:11:50.813438+00:00

Oh shit.

Basilides · 2012-05-23T04:08:39.709572+00:00

but I do not think the current SBC ought to be seen as entirely bad just because of the past.

But Jesus said a bad tree cannot produce good fruit.

Basilides · 2012-05-23T04:04:29.031949+00:00

Now there's something to talk about, which, I assume, is what you've been trying to get across the whole time.

Yes!

I would say satanism is a clear line in the sand, as well as trying to present an alternate messiah- that would be clearly gone wrong.

But promoting and defending slavery is not clearly wrong.

Which I'm still confused about.

God had to accept the condemnation of Jesus in order to save a few humans. And who condemned Jesus? Ultimately it was God who knowingly condemned Jesus by sending him to earth. And who was Jesus? God. God condemned himself.

Here is a pretty good synopsis.

I have to read that whole thing to get to what you call the Southern Baptist ___________?

I'm saying you have a misunderstanding of the verse.

Agh!

That's a Charlie Brown "agh!"

Basilides · 2012-05-23T03:55:09.026258+00:00

Seriously? I like my little dogs.

Basilides · 2012-05-23T03:54:30.520607+00:00

So do I. I see contradictions.

DigitalSpark · 2012-05-23T03:53:26.153369+00:00

The Bible does not need to even exist.

"You study the Scriptures diligently because you think that in them you have eternal life. These are the very Scriptures that testify about me, yet you refuse to come to me to have life. (John 5:39-40)

The letter from Christ is written on the heart, not on paper.

DigitalSpark · 2012-05-23T03:49:38.702788+00:00

1) Not true; Adam was not deceived

Where did I say Adam was deceived?

he knew it was a lie.

If he knew it was a lie why did he eat the fruit? If I told you arsenic would not kill you, would you drink arsenic even though you knew what I told you was a lie?

these were perfect humans

How does a perfect thing exhibit imperfection?

But in accord with justice, the price of the ransom had to be paid;

But how can we say that Jesus needed to die so that the Christian god could remain true to his word (satisfy his sense of justice) when Christianity teaches us that the Christian god went back on his word to make the new religion?

The Christian god stated that the Mosaic law was eternal and that he would never undo the covenant despite the behavior of the Jews.

"They will pay for their sins because they rejected my laws and abhorred my decrees. 44 Yet in spite of this, when they are in the land of their enemies, I will not reject them or abhor them so as to destroy them completely, breaking my covenant with them. I am the LORD their God. 45 But for their sake I will remember the covenant with their ancestors whom I brought out of Egypt in the sight of the nations to be their God. I am the LORD.’”

46 These are the decrees, the laws and the regulations that the LORD established at Mount Sinai between himself and the Israelites through Moses." (Leviticus 26)

The Christian god restated this promise at several other points in the Old Testament.

Yet Paul maintains that the Christian god rejected the Jews and abolished the Mosaic covenant and law.

19 You will say then, “Branches (the Jews) were broken off so that I (the Gentile believers) could be grafted in.” 20 Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but tremble. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, he will not spare you either. (Romans 11)

But in Leviticus 26 the Christian god said that despite the unbelief of the Jews:

"I will not reject them or abhor them so as to destroy them completely, breaking my covenant with them."

Paul goes on to call the Christian god a liar again when he says that the Christian god will un-reject the Jews if they cease their unbelief in Jesus!

"23 And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again."

But, again, in Leviticus 26 the Christian god said that in spite of the transgressions of the Jews he would not reject them or break his covenant with them.

If the Mosaic covenant passed away, the Christian god is a liar...and his sense of justice is not worth two cents.

Paul, in his usual slippery style, has found a half-way measure to bring the Jews back into the Christian god's good graces, someday...

"Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way all Israel will be saved." (Romans 11)

So keep on converting those heathens. Once the number of converted heathens reaches that unknown tipping point, the Christian god will un-reject the Jews.

Even though he promised never to reject them.

"I will not reject them or abhor them so as to destroy them completely, breaking my covenant with them." (Leviticus 26:44)

The bible teaches that the vast majority, especially of those calling themselves 'christians"

Jesus says the vast majority of all humans will be damned for eternity.

4) The idea that Jesus is the same person as the father is not a scriptural teaching. The trinity is not taught in scripture nor did it begin with christendom. So, no, Jesus is not "Him".

Are you a Jehovah's Witness?

5) No, reread - we do. They did not.

Then how did they do the wrong thing?

the clearing of God's name and reputation that Satan smeared in Eden

WTF?

the promised salvation of willingly submissive mankind.

And what would mankind be submitting to? God's will.

Each person would be giving up his own will and submitting to God's will.

1) You want to live as a robot, with no free will, no choice?

DigitalSpark · 2012-05-23T03:15:07.249816+00:00

1) You want to live as a robot, with no free will, no choice?

That is the goal of every Christian. "Not my will Lord but your will."

OR would you rather program your child to 'love' you and live in a way that you prescribed?

"Train a child in the way he should go, and when he is old he will not turn from it." (Proverbs 22:6)

"we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ. 6 And we will be ready to punish every act of disobedience, once your obedience is complete." (2 Cor 10)

2) Who gave birth to God's kingdom? The 'seed' refers primarily to Jesus,

Then who is the woman?

and "await" until his Father gives him the word to rule (many prophecies in the OT speak to this;

There is no indication that the second "Lord" in Psalm 110 left heaven, went to earth, got killed, came back to life and then floated up to heaven again.

And you are using a translation that appeals to you.

Careful scrutiny of these scriptures indicate we may in fact be seeing fulfillment in our lives...

Someone has been making that statement every day for the last 1,900 years.

ThisIsMyRedditLogin · 2012-05-23T02:49:50.063373+00:00

Good to know you were born knowing everything you will ever know.

honestchristian · 2012-05-23T02:44:11.616662+00:00

You are arguing that...

Adam willfully entered into a relationship with sin that is exactly like the “knowing” of a wife. He joined together with and bonded permanently with sin – he “knew” evil.

Therefore you are also arguing that Adam did not enter into a relationship with righteousness/good/God until he ate the fruit. You are arguing that Adam did not join together with and bond permanently with righteousness/good/God – he did not “know” good – until he ate the fruit.

If your idiosyncratic definition of "knowing" applies to evil it also applies to good.

We are, after all, talking about the fruit of the tree of the knowledge (the "knowing") of evil AND good.

Basilides · 2012-05-22T20:50:35.952129+00:00

How does that rule out judging people in your personal life?

Basilides · 2012-05-22T20:49:22.895185+00:00

They are cute from a distance.

Basilides · 2012-05-22T20:48:16.227585+00:00

I assume at the same time He forgives anyone.

OK. But the point of my post was that this particular Church was led by Satan. Either that or slavery was not bad. There has got to be some point at which "bad" behavior becomes so pervasively or intensely "bad" that the institution or person perpetrating the actio9n cannot possibly be led by God.

you're saying...God must do so, because He is God?

I'm saying God condemned himself. On the cross.

First off, you're using 'Church' in a too wide manner;

So now the Southern Baptist Church is not a church. What, pray tell, is the Southern Baptist Church if not a church?

secondly, it's people who sin- blame them.

Church membership is not composed of chimpanzees. And Church policy is supposedly an expression of the Body of Christ.

I'm saying you're misinterpreting the verses

So a good tree does bear bad fruit.

honestchristian · 2012-05-22T20:39:04.302517+00:00

A man can know intellectually what sex is without having participated in it, and know all kinds of things about his finance without “becoming one” with her.

You are arguing that Adam and Eve did not experience "good" until they sinned.

honestchristian · 2012-05-22T20:34:18.558798+00:00

Just because Adam wasn't created with sin, it doesn't follow that he could never sin.

But it does follow that a man in heaven could never sin. Why not just make people like that in the first place?

Basilides · 2012-05-22T20:30:17.097939+00:00

I think squirrel monkeys are cute.

Basilides · 2012-05-22T20:29:35.732113+00:00

And where does Jesus sanction this form of judgment?

Basilides · 2012-05-22T20:28:49.701491+00:00

You bastard!

DigitalSpark · 2012-05-22T20:28:29.095639+00:00

"the one who subjected it" is God?

Yes. And you answered the question yourself...

Back to the scripture you raised in Romans 8; immediately after what you quoted, v.21 on lays out God's will.

Basilides · 2012-05-22T20:25:23.816466+00:00

I've no idea where you're getting "spiritual man" and "unspiritual man" from. Ad hominem much?

Good Lord, man. I am accusing you of insulting me!

Basilides · 2012-05-22T20:24:32.333440+00:00

Dealing With a Case of Incest

Matthew 7:1 does not say...

"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. Except in cases of incest. Then it's okay for you to judge."

You're also missing the difference between judging a person in a case (judging actions) vs judging them in your personal life.

Another distinction that Jesus did not make. And Paul was not a judge presiding over a court. Sheez.

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